Hi,
I'm sure you've had this kind of question before but please indulge me as I have not discovered a satisfactory answer yet.

I have a mixer ( Soundcraft Compact 4 for Laptop) and a lovely huge 80's 4 track (Akai MG614) with a brilliant mixer on it running into my PC.
They both have built in preamps but I am confused over whether or not to invest in standalone mic preamp to run into my mixers, I am not interested in raising the signal but I am interested in "Warming" the sound up before it gets into the PC so would a preamp be useful or would I be looking at buying something else?

Any help would be err "helpful".
Thanks.

Come on people.

I've seen some the posts on this board and you can all be quite opinionated so give me something to go on...


Anything....?

Howdy, Medication 77.

Exactly what type of "pre-amp" are you referring to ... a microphone pre-amp? What is the rest of your signal chain, and what type of projects are you attempting to record? Music? Voice?

As Ricky Ricardo used to say, "'Splain!"

Thanks for the reply ghull.

I am referring to a mic preamp and I am primarily recording vocals and some guitar (not Bass) with a mic also.


at the moment I'm running a sm58 into the Akai and then into a soundblaster 2 on my PC into cubase vst32. the Akai raises the signal quite well and seems to be a very clear and clean sound but I seem to be missing some warmth or character when it gets onto the PC I can tweak the sound and get a pretty good sound but I don't want to rely just on the PC.

I've tried to use the "preamp" on my pod but that only seems to be good for bass guitar.

As a note I am going to be replacing the soundblaster with a m-audio delta 44 or 66, which I assume will improve things as well.

Hope this is enough.

Thanks for the specifics ... now we can proceed.

First of all, and this is good news ... you are currently operating on the most basic level of recording. You can look forward to seeing improvements from this point on at about every corner you decide to turn.

Yes, by virtue of a Delta 44 or 66, you are going to have a cleaner sound, versus the SoundBlaster card.

From there ... it is a all a matter of which way you want to go -- and here comes the phrase that you know was going to come at you eventually ... it is simply a matter of what your budget will allow.

On a primary response level, "warmth" is added by the inclusion of "tubes" ... and they can be had in the mic pre, a compressor, or in the condenser microphone. Also, don't forget the "warming" effect of a ribbon microphone.

I can tell you that I have conferred with a lot of older engineers ... who have reminded me that they have recorded many a successful vocal session with workhorse dynamics ... like the Shure SM-7, Beyer M-88, or EV RE16 ... driven by a respectably good mic pre. As far as recording the guitar, you didn't say whether it was acoustic, or you were attempting to mic your amplifier output.

You can also add "warmth" on the software level with various tube emulator plug-ins. Again, plenty of those to choose from as well.

I hate the fact that so much of this comes down to "How much money do you have to spend?" ... but it always does, eventually. Once you determine -- and announce -- that level, I am sure you will begin seeing some specific model suggestions.

I hope this is the beginning of helping you -- and perhaps prompting some other people to open up.

This may seem dumb but say I was to buy a preamp tomorrow would it be okay to put it through my mixing desk or would I acheive better results putting the preamp straight into the PC's soundcard and I take it from what you say that a preamp (at least a valve one ) will actually make a tonal difference, I know this may all be quite simple to you but I keep reading about how a this or that preamp doesnt colour the sound and then people talking about how some vintage preamps sound which seems to have confused me about what they do beyond raising a signal.

From what you have said would it be wise to invest in a preamp after I get a new soundcard and then think about a better mic after that or get the better mic first?

I use the PSP Vintage warmer to warm things up I just don't want to have to rely on it all the time and I would like to get some different flavours in the sound rather than always use the vintage warmer.

Oh and by the way I am mic'ing an amp and also an acoustic guitar.

Thanks

also budget is kind of an issue but I am thinking about buying a preamp kit like a JLM or a Seventh Circle kit.


Even some of the budget preamps look quite attractive (behringer mic200) or is that just wishful thinking and is it worth waiting a while longer for one of the above kits and then buy a budget condenser mic (ADK)

IF this is any help to you, the preamp I use and find amazing value is the Tube MP. I also use it with a RNC compressor again great value. You can search for info on the web. A good condensor mic would also do you wonders....just going by my own experiences.

Yes. Two excellent values there ... the ART Tube MP and the the FMR Audio RNC. Excellent values for minimal investment. Good starting point upgrades for you. More to come ...

While I agree with you on the RNC, I disagree about the Tube MP... it's somewhat usefull as a Bass DI, but I'd never use it as a pre. It's noisy, and very muddy-sounding.

Better budget alternatives are the Groove Tubes brick, or the FMR Audio RNP....
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Bruce Valeriani - Mix Engineer

Problem with the 2 units you like is they are not cheap. They both run in the $500+ range ea. At least the Tube MP does a reasonable job for $65.

I don't think "muddy" is ever reasonable, at whatever price point..... but whatever....
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Bruce Valeriani - Mix Engineer

I can understand what bluebearsound is saying about muddy and the two units you recommended look like they do a damn fine job but taking into account a limited budget would it not be more important to get a budget preamp and a budget condenser to start with (upgrade later).

Does anyone have any experience with a studio projects VTB 1, that would be about as far in terms of price I am able to go or a TUBEPre by presonus.

Welcome to the beautiful, subjective world of audio. I will say this. It does look like it is a no-brainer regarding the RNC. I have one, and it is a very clean, quiet, no-nonsense box.

I have also heard plenty of kudos for the FMR Audio Really Nice Pre-Amp (the RNP). But it is about $475 for a pair of pres ... versus the aforementioned $65 or so for a Tube MP.

You may be in a position to check around and borrow one, or several units of different makes and configurations.

There is also the notion of a multi-purpose box like a Symetrix 528E ... that has a mic pre, compressor, EQ, and gate all in one. I'm not saying each section is the best example of its type ... but it does represent an improvement over what you have now ... and in case of the 528E, it is a broadcast studio standard -- and has been for many years.

This is audio ... and there are hundreds of ways of skinning the proverbial cat.

Quote:

This is audio ... and there are hundreds of ways of skinning the proverbial cat.

So very true
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Recording Studio Suntans